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blackriverrosi
blackriverrosi
The moors...her own and she....theirs.
Mar 24 2009, 9:24 PM EDT | Post edited: Mar 24 2009, 9:24 PM EDT
Note: I am reading "Sunset Song" by Lewis Grassic Gibbon. The mother says to her daughter, " Oh, Chris, my lass, there are better things than your books or studies or loving or bedding, there's the countryside your own, you its, in the days when you're neither bairn nor woman".

Emily, the moors, her own and she, theirs.........the heath and the cliff.......the eternal rocks, the bones of life itself.

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Posted Anonymously
1. RE: The moors...her own and she....theirs.
Sep 2 2009, 11:53 AM EDT | Post edited: Sep 2 2009, 11:53 AM EDT
Picture the scene: at the same time that the Bronte girls were mooching about the moors, Thoreau was wandering the woods. Do you find this valuable?    
either/or
either/or
2. RE: The moors...her own and she....theirs.
Sep 2 2009, 12:38 PM EDT | Post edited: Sep 2 2009, 12:38 PM EDT
Reminds me of her poem:

We would not leave our native home
For any world beyond the Tomb.
No - rather on thy kindly breast
Let us be laid in lasting rest;
Or waken but to share with thee
A mutual immortality.

Do you think she believed that self-awareness or consciousness continued after death?
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Posted Anonymously
3. RE: The moors...her own and she....theirs.
Sep 2 2009, 2:32 PM EDT | Post edited: Sep 2 2009, 2:32 PM EDT
Who knows what goes on in another's mind, whatever they say or write? 1  out of 1 found this valuable. Do you?    

Posted Anonymously
4. RE: The moors...her own and she....theirs.
Sep 2 2009, 3:44 PM EDT | Post edited: Sep 2 2009, 3:44 PM EDT
God alone knows for sure. Still, to communicate verbally or through the written word presupposes that one means to be understood. 1  out of 1 found this valuable. Do you?    

Posted Anonymously
5. RE: The moors...her own and she....theirs.
Sep 2 2009, 9:10 PM EDT | Post edited: Sep 2 2009, 9:10 PM EDT
"Reminds me of her poem:

We would not leave our native home
For any world beyond the Tomb.
No - rather on thy kindly breast
Let us be laid in lasting rest;
Or waken but to share with thee
A mutual immortality.

Do you think she believed that self-awareness or consciousness continued after death? "
I believe Emily says she would not willing trade her earthly home for any promised life after death.....she seems to accept an eternal rest in the earth, or an eternal awareness shared with the earth.
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blackriverrosi
blackriverrosi
6. RE: The moors...her own and she....theirs.
Sep 2 2009, 9:13 PM EDT | Post edited: Sep 2 2009, 9:13 PM EDT
"I believe Emily says she would not willing trade her earthly home for any promised life after death.....she seems to accept an eternal rest in the earth, or an eternal awareness shared with the earth."
This is Rosi, I forgot to sign in for my little piece on Emily's earthly home, the only one she loved and owned.
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blackriverrosi
blackriverrosi
7. RE: The moors...her own and she....theirs.
Sep 2 2009, 9:16 PM EDT | Post edited: Sep 2 2009, 9:16 PM EDT
"Picture the scene: at the same time that the Bronte girls were mooching about the moors, Thoreau was wandering the woods."
This is Rosi, I forgot to sign in for my little piece on Emily's earthly home, the only one she loved and owned.

Thoreau, I believe was only playing at being woodsy.... the Brontes were moorsy in earnest.
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Posted Anonymously
8. RE: The moors...her own and she....theirs.
Sep 3 2009, 2:45 AM EDT | Post edited: Sep 3 2009, 2:45 AM EDT
"This is Rosi, I forgot to sign in for my little piece on Emily's earthly home, the only one she loved and owned.

Thoreau, I believe was only playing at being woodsy.... the Brontes were moorsy in earnest."
Rosie. I was merely drawing a parallel in time. But if one is talking about practicalities here on earth, Thoreau was a pretty logical type. Are you dismissing Emerson as well? Can poetic genius, which we love, be considered unconcious? But perhaps we are venturing into physiology here. Didn't Transcendentalism come to both men?.
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Posted Anonymously
9. RE: The moors...her own and she....theirs.
Sep 3 2009, 3:46 AM EDT | Post edited: Sep 3 2009, 3:46 AM EDT
"God alone knows for sure. Still, to communicate verbally or through the written word presupposes that one means to be understood."
Agreed, but understood by whom? Do you think poetry comes easy?
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Posted Anonymously
10. RE: The moors...her own and she....theirs.
Sep 3 2009, 6:06 AM EDT | Post edited: Sep 3 2009, 6:06 AM EDT
I think it's meant to be understood by both the author and the reader. I think poetry's often very difficult to be understood; as life is, but the potential rewards justify the effort. Emily is easier for me to relate to than some, I suppose, because I feel I can relate to the sufferings of her, in some ways, self-imposed isolation. Do you find this valuable?    

Posted Anonymously
11. RE: The moors...her own and she....theirs.
Sep 3 2009, 11:26 AM EDT | Post edited: Sep 3 2009, 11:26 AM EDT
"I think it's meant to be understood by both the author and the reader. I think poetry's often very difficult to be understood; as life is, but the potential rewards justify the effort. Emily is easier for me to relate to than some, I suppose, because I feel I can relate to the sufferings of her, in some ways, self-imposed isolation."
As I see it, I agree that at the time of writing, the poet understands his/her poem. However, at a later date. the poet may well see something quite different in the poem. Therefore, isn't the understanding of the reader entirely dependent on his/her own poetical development at the time of reading? Off at a tangent, Emily was maybe with Marvell?

"Society is all but rude,
To this delicious solitude."
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Posted Anonymously
12. RE: The moors...her own and she....theirs.
Sep 3 2009, 4:09 PM EDT | Post edited: Sep 3 2009, 4:09 PM EDT
I think I follow you; but my inclination would be to argue in favor of trying to get at the 'original intent' of the author at the time the poem's written. (I guess I'm a strict constructionist).

We can be glad Emily left us a wealth of poetry which we can follow the chronologically, with reasonable accuracy, and try to gain a whole picture of her life. Seeming contradictions only add to the fascination. Consider the last four lines of her poem beginning: "I am the only being whose doom no tongue would ask ... "

"'Twas grief enough to think mankind
All hollow, servile, insincere,
But worse to trust to my own mind
And find the same corruption there."

I read in those lines a ruthless honesty that might have given birth in her to either humility or a further hardening in pride.

I posted Marvell's 'Definition of Love' because it's one of my favorites and one I think Emily also would have liked. I appreciate your comments.
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blackriverrosi
blackriverrosi
13. RE: The moors...her own and she....theirs.
Sep 3 2009, 8:30 PM EDT | Post edited: Sep 3 2009, 8:30 PM EDT
"I think I follow you; but my inclination would be to argue in favor of trying to get at the 'original intent' of the author at the time the poem's written. (I guess I'm a strict constructionist).

We can be glad Emily left us a wealth of poetry which we can follow the chronologically, with reasonable accuracy, and try to gain a whole picture of her life. Seeming contradictions only add to the fascination. Consider the last four lines of her poem beginning: "I am the only being whose doom no tongue would ask ... "

"'Twas grief enough to think mankind
All hollow, servile, insincere,
But worse to trust to my own mind
And find the same corruption there."

I read in those lines a ruthless honesty that might have given birth in her to either humility or a further hardening in pride.

I posted Marvell's 'Definition of Love' because it's one of my favorites and one I think Emily also would have liked. I appreciate your comments."
That ruthless honesty is revealed in Wuthering Heights.
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blackriverrosi
blackriverrosi
14. RE: The moors...her own and she....theirs.
Sep 3 2009, 8:36 PM EDT | Post edited: Sep 3 2009, 8:36 PM EDT
"Rosie. I was merely drawing a parallel in time. But if one is talking about practicalities here on earth, Thoreau was a pretty logical type. Are you dismissing Emerson as well? Can poetic genius, which we love, be considered unconcious? But perhaps we are venturing into physiology here. Didn't Transcendentalism come to both men?. "
Yes, both men dabbled in "Transcendentalism". Emily was many things...all double...animal and mystic. But she wanted to live on the earth, however flawed.
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Posted Anonymously
15. RE: The moors...her own and she....theirs.
Sep 4 2009, 3:48 AM EDT | Post edited: Sep 4 2009, 3:48 AM EDT
"I think I follow you; but my inclination would be to argue in favor of trying to get at the 'original intent' of the author at the time the poem's written. (I guess I'm a strict constructionist).

We can be glad Emily left us a wealth of poetry which we can follow the chronologically, with reasonable accuracy, and try to gain a whole picture of her life. Seeming contradictions only add to the fascination. Consider the last four lines of her poem beginning: "I am the only being whose doom no tongue would ask ... "

"'Twas grief enough to think mankind
All hollow, servile, insincere,
But worse to trust to my own mind
And find the same corruption there."

I read in those lines a ruthless honesty that might have given birth in her to either humility or a further hardening in pride.

I posted Marvell's 'Definition of Love' because it's one of my favorites and one I think Emily also would have liked. I appreciate your comments."
I think your inclination is correct. I see the further unfolding as a bonus. Horace had something to say on this subject. I also agree with your reading of ruthless honesty, and speculation about her state of mind. I suspect that very few achieve this depth of self-analysis. I'd go as far as to say that some who do, could sink into utter despair.

I think you are extremely knowledgeable and I appreciate you setting this ball rolling. In exchange for one of your favourite poems, here's one of mine:

Helen, thy beauty is to me
Like those Nicean barks of yore
That gently, o'er a perfumed sea,
The weary way-worn wanderer bore
To his own native shore.

On desperate seas long wont to roam,
Thy hyacinth hair, thy classic face,
Thy Naiad airs have brought me home
To the glory that was Greece,
And the grandeur that was Rome.

Poe















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Posted Anonymously
16. RE: The moors...her own and she....theirs.
Sep 4 2009, 3:59 AM EDT | Post edited: Sep 4 2009, 3:59 AM EDT
"Yes, both men dabbled in "Transcendentalism". Emily was many things...all double...animal and mystic. But she wanted to live on the earth, however flawed."
I came into this world, not chiefly to make this a good place to live in, but to live in it, be it good or bad. ~ Thoreau.

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Posted Anonymously
17. RE: The moors...her own and she....theirs.
Sep 4 2009, 5:40 AM EDT | Post edited: Sep 4 2009, 5:40 AM EDT
You love Poe too!? I also love his poems: 'Alone' , 'The Happiest Day', and 'The Conqueror Worm'.
I think your comment on self-analysis and the danger of utter despair is right on the mark. It's the whole subject matter of Soren Kierkegaard's 'The Sickness Unto Death'.
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Posted Anonymously
18. RE: The moors...her own and she....theirs.
Sep 4 2009, 8:03 AM EDT | Post edited: Sep 4 2009, 8:03 AM EDT
"I came into this world, not chiefly to make this a good place to live in, but to live in it, be it good or bad. ~ Thoreau.

"
Good for him.
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Posted Anonymously
19. RE: The moors...her own and she....theirs.
Sep 4 2009, 10:48 AM EDT | Post edited: Sep 4 2009, 10:48 AM EDT
Interesting quote by Thoreau and certainly applicable to the earlier excerpt from Emily's poem and consistent with her a-social life. Still, it seems somewhat disingenuous coming from Thoreau. From what I know of him, if he wasn't exactly a social activist he certainly had a social conscience ... some might say a social agenda. 1  out of 1 found this valuable. Do you?    
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